So many dead people....

[PHEDG]

That, and the fact you need to use a needle would be enough to keep me the fuck away from it

Don't forget "chasing the dragon."(smoking and snorting)

[IggytheBorg]

True, but the addiction/withdrawal thing would still scare me.

[Martin]

Addiction is a disease.

Kinda. But....

He's still an asshole. An addicted asshole who left 3 kids without a dad. Just saying.

There's that. The fact that he had the means to change his fate is also shitty.

I mean, it's sad when someone dies but this is not a tragedy. It's just sad and could have been avoided.

That. Tragic ain't something I associate with a OD. Sad, but tragic, nope.

[Ben Thomas]

Respectfully disagree. When you see someone struggle with their addiction and come through it, you pray they don't have some awful event that will make them think about going back. There are a million things that can do that, most often friends unfortunately. When a family loses someone amazing, it's always a tragedy. When it was avoidable, doubly so.

[Ben Thomas]

To put it another way - is someone dying of lung cancer less tragic because that person chose to smoke?

[Anderson]

To put it another way - is someone dying of lung cancer less tragic because that person chose to smoke?

It frames the disease. But, we all are about to open a new can of worms with this.

[Timothy225]

I usually put the blame on the person who made the addict take the first hit/puff/whatever in the first place. A close friend of my brother and I got my brother into smoking, and he's been trying to quit off and on for decades. I felt no remorse in jacking said friend up against a wall for starting that shit with my brother.

I do feel bad we lost PSH, as much as I feel bad when anyone dies from their addictions - some folks have addictive personalities, and it's damn tough to beat 'em. But I temper that with the fact that, in this day and age, it's so fucking obvious that many recreational drugs are so fucking bad for you, and the momentary high you get vs. the $$$ they cost and the inevitable crash afterwards should be enough for anyone to say "no thanks" before taking that first hit or experimenting. You see it on the news, you read tons of articles, you see addicts in your own neighborhoods (go see the line at any methadone clinic - that will set you hip so damn fast it'll make your head spin) - it astonishes me anyone would ever want to try any of that stuff. If anyone does nowadays, with all the info available as to why it's a bad idea, they're a bigger idiot than I could ever give them credit for.

PSH should have known better 20+ years ago before he even started. Christ, I'm the same age he was and I knew that shit even before then. Getting laid always seemed a better high than anything I could ever imagine smoking/snorting/shooting anyway.

[Ben Thomas]

I've never tried heroin. I've tried pretty much everything else, several times. Drinking and smoking was my thing since I was 15 or so, but I went through phases with ecstasy and coke as well. The problem with addiction is that a lot of the time, you don't even know why you're doing it. You KNOW it's bad for you, you feel bad - emotionally, mentally and especially physically, eventually - but there is some self-destructive part of you that gets off on the idea of killing yourself.

For most people it takes a real scare or a near miss to finally chuck it in (if then). Unfortunately, some people never get that near miss and it's curtains. I'm not defending what Hoffman did, but it's not as easy or as straightforward as some of the things said in this thread. I quit smoking 2 months ago and it was the easiest thing in the world, because I got really sick and could barely breathe and was terrified that it might be the worst news. When I got better (took nearly a month), every time I think I might want a smoke, I remember that feeling as if it was a glimpse into my future and I don't want a smoke any more.

When it comes to personality-altering substances though, all bets are off and 'reason' goes out the window. Yeah, addiction is a motherfucker.

[B_Metal]

I know this makes me a bad person but I'm kind of hoping someone else will die so we can get off the addiction debate. Also I'm fat because I'm addicted to food. DON'T JUDGE ME IT'S A DISEASE*

*relax Nancy's I'm joking.

[Abraham Smashington]

To put it another way - is someone dying of lung cancer less tragic because that person chose to smoke?

In my opinion?

Yes. Especially in this day and age. It's fucking terrible, but they made their bed.

Now if a person dies from lung cancer but didn't smoke? That's tragic.

I say this as a former 13+year smoker.

[Ben Thomas]

Ok. But I was 15 when I started smoking in the 90s. It's real fucking hard to stop after a while. Like, REAL hard. Could still kill me, even if I never smoke another one. Was I dumb to start? Absolutely. But I was fucking 15. 15-year-olds are dumb as shit.

[Nathan]

15-year-olds are dumb as shit.

Kids.

[B_Metal]

WOULD SOMEBODY ELSE FUCKING DIE ALREADY FOR PETE'S SAKE!!!

[Abraham Smashington]

I'm with you Ben. I started when I was 13-14 and smoked until I was about 28-29. Kids are dumb as fuck. But at a certain point you either come to terms with "If I keep doing this, I will die" or you quit and still have that possibility of getting it and dying, but at least the chance goes down significantly. Or you just say FUCK IT completely because everything give you cancer at this point.

[Abraham Smashington]

I'm also stuck in a horrible pessimistic mood lately, so my opinions are obviously slanted.