Avengers Assemble!

[IggytheBorg]

Well said. I agree. But maybe because I'm just too much of a geek to not be sucked into the team up movie concept, I don't like it better than the Avengers.

[gravedigger]

Matt said it very well. One of the things that pleasantly surprised me about Winter Soldier was how the Russos got good performances out of Evans and Johansson. I felt like they were both pretty wooden in the previous MCU movies but finally figured things out this time. And, yeah, the '70s political thriller vibe really does it for me.

[Martin]

I gave an intellectual reason -- I like Whedon's unique voice and his work with characters -- I got back Beavis and Butthead.

So you: intelligent, and rest of us: dumb. Yeah, Josh, that Devin comparison is kinda on point.

CA:TWS has a certain grounded feel to it that appeals to me...very 70s in tone. It doesn't feel like a superhero film at all in terms of execution, totally setting it apart from the other Marvel films (in my opinion). The fight scenes are uniformly excellent and thrilling. The character dynamics are all interesting, much more interesting that what you find in some of the other films. The acting quality is also of a higher standard that what you find in the others.

For all of those reasons, I personally cite it as the 'best' of the Marvel films. I personally find IRON MAN or THE AVENGERS to be 'more fun', but they also both have qualities about them that irk me. Nothing in TWS irks me.

That movie was such a throwback to the old 70's conspiracy/spy movie à la Three Days of the Condor, and yet completely melded that with the MCU identity. Perfect mesh. Well directed action, performances and a solid story to boot.

But personally, my favorite is Guardians of the Galaxy, by a small margin, over Winter Soldier. Gunn just fucking owned it

[Abraham Smashington]

everyone just settle down. This is a thread about superheroes. Don't be superjerks. OHHHHHHhhhhhh

I can see why people like Joss and his movies. I can see why people don't. My only issue is that I want more "fun" movies like Ant and Guardians.

[Abraham Smashington]

because fuck, Ant-Man is great dammit.

[Martin]

everyone just settle down. This is a thread about superheroes. Don't be superjerks. OHHHHHHhhhhhh

I can see why people like Joss and his movies. I can see why people don't. My only issue is that I want more "fun" movies like Ant and Guardians.

No worries, but we're among friends, so I don't get the holier-than-thou attitude here. It's not CHUD.

Ant-Man was the bomb. The more I think of it, the more I like it.

[BMichaelKrol]

It's funny how democracy works.

What the fuck does that even mean? So now majority rules when it comes to the quality of art?

Using your logic, Fleetwood Mac's Rumours is one of the greatest records of all time. Got it.

So you: intelligent, and rest of us: dumb.

No, not dumb. Just inarticulate. And overly sensitive too.

CA:TWS has a certain grounded feel to it that appeals to me...very 70s in tone. It doesn't feel like a superhero film at all in terms of execution, totally setting it apart from the other Marvel films (in my opinion). The fight scenes are uniformly excellent and thrilling. The character dynamics are all interesting, much more interesting that what you find in some of the other films. The acting quality is also of a higher standard that what you find in the others.

For all of those reasons, I personally cite it as the 'best' of the Marvel films. I personally find IRON MAN or THE AVENGERS to be 'more fun', but they also both have qualities about them that irk me. Nothing in TWS irks me.

These are reasons that I like the film. However, the best movies in Phase 2 (IM3, Guardians, AOU, Ant-Man) each had a unique voice and vision that goes beyond what normal superhero movies do. Beyond the genre blending that TWS does, there's not much in there that a 1000 other competent action directors couldn't have done.

That's what bothers me about TWS. I've seen good fight scenes before; I've seen pixels smash into other pixels before. And while the FX and fighting were done well, spectacle does little for me. I'm more interested in characters and stories than seeing another building get blown up.

And let me be clear here (so Martin feels included), I don't dislike TWS. I'm just saying there are other Phase 2 movies that are better, and they're better because the creators put their unique voice into those films. James Gunn's sensibilities made Guardians very interesting; Mackay/Wright made Ant-Man great; Whedon (whose hands are all over phase 2) made AOU an interesting movie with great dialogue.

What's troubling to me about Phase 3, is the fact that Marvel is shying away from the more unique artists and giving their big franchise to the Russo Brothers. I don't like that. I don't want or need to see more pixel smashing. I want to see a good story told well. I figure at this stage in geek movie development, we should demand better and more interesting movies, than the same rehash of garbage we've seen before. If I want that, I'll go see Suicide Squad or Pathetic Rim 2. Marvel should be better than that.

[Matt]

Valid points, Krol. I think it's just a matter of personal preference more than anything. What any viewer connects with is subjective, and I found that I connected with TWS better than any other Marvel film in Phase 2. Every single element of the film flat out worked for me, and worked like gangbusters. I don't need it to be a big artistic vision...I just need it to execute what it sets out to do WELL, and this film did that. The characters all worked and had interesting things to do and say, and the actors were all well directed in their roles. Add in the tone/feel of the film and bam...I was hooked.

[BMichaelKrol]

Valid points, Krol. I think it's just a matter of personal preference more than anything. What any viewer connects with is subjective, and I found that I connected with TWS better than any other Marvel film in Phase 2. Every single element of the film flat out worked for me, and worked like gangbusters. I don't need it to be a big artistic vision...I just need it to execute what it sets out to do WELL, and this film did that. The characters all worked and had interesting things to do and say, and the actors were all well directed in their roles. Add in the tone/feel of the film and bam...I was hooked.

Yeah, like I said, it's not a bad movie. Had Guardians or Ant-Man or the unfairly maligned AOU been released any other time, TWS would be #1.

I think I'm coming at this from a different frame of mind too. I'm studying screenwriting at UCLA right now, and so I'm evaluating movies from that perspective. The stuff that Whedon does well is very, very difficult to do. Same thing with Gunn, McKay, etc.

In fact, the best movie/screenplay I've seen from a pure structure stand point is, believe it or not, Talladega Nights. Written by Adam McKay.

[Martin]

The stuff that Whedon does well is very, very difficult to do. Same thing with Gunn, McKay, etc.

In fact, the best movie/screenplay I've seen from a pure structure stand point is, believe it or not, Talladega Nights. Written by Adam McKay.

On that point, I agree with Whedon, since I'm a fan.

On that second point, WTF?

[Abraham Smashington]

I'll come at you like a howler monkey Chip!

[Anderson]

What the fuck does that even mean? So now majority rules when it comes to the quality of art?

Using your logic, Fleetwood Mac's Rumours is one of the greatest records of all time. Got it.



No, not dumb. Just inarticulate. And overly sensitive too.



These are reasons that I like the film. However, the best movies in Phase 2 (IM3, Guardians, AOU, Ant-Man) each had a unique voice and vision that goes beyond what normal superhero movies do. Beyond the genre blending that TWS does, there's not much in there that a 1000 other competent action directors couldn't have done.

That's what bothers me about TWS. I've seen good fight scenes before; I've seen pixels smash into other pixels before. And while the FX and fighting were done well, spectacle does little for me. I'm more interested in characters and stories than seeing another building get blown up.

And let me be clear here (so Martin feels included), I don't dislike TWS. I'm just saying there are other Phase 2 movies that are better, and they're better because the creators put their unique voice into those films. James Gunn's sensibilities made Guardians very interesting; Mackay/Wright made Ant-Man great; Whedon (whose hands are all over phase 2) made AOU an interesting movie with great dialogue.

What's troubling to me about Phase 3, is the fact that Marvel is shying away from the more unique artists and giving their big franchise to the Russo Brothers. I don't like that. I don't want or need to see more pixel smashing. I want to see a good story told well. I figure at this stage in geek movie development, we should demand better and more interesting movies, than the same rehash of garbage we've seen before. If I want that, I'll go see Suicide Squad or Pathetic Rim 2. Marvel should be better than that.

I was commenting on your rant and how others ranted back at you with equal measure drowning you out.

You like Whedon, that's great. I'm saying that he isn't the anchor for the MCU. They will move on past him.

I would make a joke about your need to keep flexing attitude about the matter, but I just don't give a fuck.

[Anderson]

I stopped for a second to read back.

You're defending Whedon trying to ham fist his usual aesthetic into Marvel event films with your recent studies at UCLA?

Also, the guys are emotional and pretty articulate. Fuck you on the Rumors front. I'm ready to bitch whip a copy of Don't Stop into your fucking face at this point.

If you really want to throw down on the ever-so weak and unsteady ground of AOU, Whedon and the MCU...let's have at it.

Hopefully, everyone can get it out of their system and we can go back to talking about better movies. You cunts don't talk about Italian Western comedies enough.

[Anderson]

Ricky Bobby is the best script you've read in your scholarly endeavors? Who the fuck are you, Manohla Dargis?

I wish you would've read that how bad that UCLA statement came out as an out-of-the-blue drop. I want to assume that you're not being a prick, Krol. But, fuck.

You're a screenwriting student at UCLA. That's like being the smartest Barista at Starbucks. You're still one fish in a sea of millions. You're spending money studying something that will either result in a) nothing happening, b) having to kiss the worst kinds of ass to get any momentum or c) getting ignored for anything that John Landis's kid pulls out of his dickhole.

Kudos on studying and learning something new about writing, but using that as a standard of merit over the people here? That's fucking bullshit, man. I should know, as I was a member of the Burger King Kids Club.

[Abraham Smashington]

everyone needs to relax a bit.

Can we talk about the possibility that Dr. Strange is going to punch us all in the dicks? Cause it may../..