STAR WARS, INDY , HOWARD THE DUCK DEUCE; AND MORE

[BMichaelKrol]

So they created an elite squad of stormtrooper to off an old man and a muppet. Got it.

And anyway, no Jedi destroyed either of the Death Stars.

[Trejo]

Luke didn't destroy the first Death Star? Or are you calling that a technicality as he wasn't a Jedi at the time

[BMichaelKrol]

That's not a technicality at all. He wasn't a Jedi until the third movie.

In fact, in the grand scheme of things, Jedis didn't really do much to end the Empire at all.

[Martin]

Come on. You really like to argue for nothing, do you? He used the Force to blow up the Death Star. Now, we can debate WHEN you technically become a Jedi, but pretty much everyone assumes he's becoming one by the end of the first movie.

SW Rebels pretty confirms that the Empire knew Jedis were hidden around. And the Empire's hunt on them. They had already started to organize the hunt with Inquisitors, so while I see the the units they had back then were dusted, it would make total fucking sense that the Empire would adapt to the return of Jedis since one took down their Emperor and Vader.

And in the grand scheme of things, Obi Wan got Luke to the Rebellion, and set him on the path to become a Jedi Knight. And he's to one who "killed" Palpatine (yeah, we know how)

[Abraham Smashington]

[Anderson]

If all the Jedi are dead except for one bro, how come there's a anti-Jedi stormtrooper?

I missed all of this, while on Meteor Watch 2015.

As such,

  Spoiler: HUGE FUCKING SPOILERS! 

Lights please, because we're sharing a ton of new leaks from tie-in material, the films and the Lucasfilm merchandising bonanza.


The First Order formed almost immediately after the Empire. In fact, Endor wasn't the fall of the Empire. In case of death, The Emperor had orders throughout the Galaxy to destroy Rebel strongholds and key planets of importance such as Naboo. Some survived, some didn't.

Only upper brass Imperials knew what happened, while the remnants of the Empire pushed that the Death Star II's destruction and the Emperor and Vader's deaths were Rebel propaganda.

They fought between 12-18 months after Endor until the Empire finally surrendered at Jakku.

The Imperial Loyalists were pushed to the far Outer Rim and given a small amount of loyal planets to thrive on. While the Rebels reformed the Republic with several people who kinda missed the old Empire.

Imperial Senators became Republic Senators overnight and hated the fact that they weren't bribed or treated with privilege anymore. So, a few started meeting with an unknown benefactor (Snoke?) to begin undermining the Republic.

While the Republic spent decades fighting this, everything with Luke and outlying concerns went to Hell. So, Leia joined with several veteran Republic military members to form the Resistance.

The Resistance is a private guerilla operation designed to fight the spreading influence of The First Order (re-emerging Empire) over the Republic and others.

Since they were pushed to the edges of existence, they were in private for so long and few realized that they were quietly rebuilding an army.

[Anderson]

That's not a technicality at all. He wasn't a Jedi until the third movie.

In fact, in the grand scheme of things, Jedis didn't really do much to end the Empire at all.

Two last surviving members of the Order fostered a Light Side Messiah to destroy the only known central government in existence.

That would be like ISIS hiding Jesus for 18 years and then having him destroy the Western World.

[Trejo]

That's not a technicality at all. He wasn't a Jedi until the third movie.

OK. Life's too short.

I now return you all to your regular scheduled Star Wars'ing.

[BMichaelKrol]

Wow. Such hostility to any challenge to the dominant paradigm. Thank God you people left CHUD to create your own slice of Internet heaven...

Anyway, I'll take your objections in turn. Starting with Martin, since he's my favorite...

Come on. You really like to argue for nothing, do you?

Just like sex, arguing requires two parties my sweet. Of course, that could explain your confusion...

He used the Force to blow up the Death Star.

No, he used photon torpedoes. His aiming was assisted by the force. But using the force does not make one a Jedi. It makes him a talented amateur. He's like a very talented high school QB; good, probably better than his peers, but definitely not ready for the pros.

Since you're Canadian, I'll use an example you might understand. The best push broom sweeper at Tim Horton's aint ready for Olympic level curling. Better?

Now, we can debate WHEN you technically become a Jedi, but pretty much everyone assumes he's becoming one by the end of the first movie.

Who assumes this? Was it...
Obi Wan? Who sent Luke to Dagobah tocontinue his Jedi training?
Yoda? Who told Luke and Obi Wan that Luke was too old to begin the training? Or, in Return of the Jedi when Luke declares himself a Jedi and Yoda mocks him.
Emperor Palpatine? Who says to Vader that the son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi.
Vader? Who doesn't correct Palpatine when he says Luke isn't a Jedi.
Luke himself? Who doesn't say he is a Jedi until the Climax of the 3rd film.

Face it, this cat wasn't a Jedi until the 3rd film. You remember that one, the one called RETURN of the Jedi.

SW Rebels pretty confirms that the Empire knew Jedis were hidden around. And the Empire's hunt on them. They had already started to organize the hunt with Inquisitors, so while I see the the units they had back then were dusted, it would make total fucking sense that the Empire would adapt to the return of Jedis since one took down their Emperor and Vader.

I don't watch Rebels so I can't speak to your interpretation. Still, how many Jedis are out there? Enough to necessitate an entire separate kind of Stormtrooper? We'll see in December, I guess.

And in the grand scheme of things, Obi Wan got Luke to the Rebellion, and set him on the path to become a Jedi Knight. And he's to one who "killed" Palpatine (yeah, we know how)

And Luke did...what? He destroyed the first Death Star. A good victory, sure, but a) they built another one and b) if he hadn't, the only losses would be the base at Yavin IV. Significant, certainly, but I don't think it would've been the end of the Rebellion, since we see an entire fleet in Jedi that was also part of the Rebellion. Destroying the base at Yavin IV would take out Leia and her people. But I'd argue that would have very little impact on the Command and Control of the Rebellion since she doesn't seem that important to the military.

BUT HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT!

Easy. The Rebellion lets her go off on a side mission to rescue Han Solo. A neat guy but not an irreplaceable military asset. That's good proof right there that she's not essential to the functioning of the Rebellion at a macro level.

Or, to put it another way, Five Star Generals aint going on rescue raids.

Now, on to your other assertion that Luke killed Palpatine. He didn't, Vader did, and even if Vader hadn't, it wouldn't matter anyway.

If Luke had turned in the throne room, how would that affect the outcome of the Battle of Endor? If you said, not at all, you'd be right.

Here's a thought experiment. Let's say Luke told the Emperor, "You know what? Fuck it. I'm joining up with you cats. Your uniforms are better." About ten minutes into their celebration, the Death Star would still be destroyed and Vader and Palpatine would be dead. Because it was the military operation on Endor and in the space around the new Death Star that ultimately defeated the Empire. The military operation that Palpatine was largely ignoring, concentrating on Luke (that's what CiC's do: they create strategy and other people implement it).

It goes like this. Lando blew up the Death Star. Lando could blow up the Death Star because Han Solo captured the shield generator on Endor. Han could capture the shield generator on Endor because the Ewoks mounted a counter insurgency against the occupying force that had neutralized Han Solo's mission.

So, in essence, the all powerful Jedis had less to do with the Rebellion's (apparent) military victory over the Empire than the Ewoks.

Stick that in your craw.

[BMichaelKrol]

OK. Life's too short.

I now return you all to your regular scheduled Star Wars'ing.

Jump in. I'll take on all comers.

[BMichaelKrol]

Two last surviving members of the Order fostered a Light Side Messiah to destroy the only known central government in existence.

That would be like ISIS hiding Jesus for 18 years and then having him destroy the Western World.

And as I just pointed out, that Light Messiah did precisely dick.

[Anderson]

And as I just pointed out, that Light Messiah did precisely dick.

By that rationale, Russia won the European Theater in WWII.

[BMichaelKrol]

What would have happened in WWII if Germany wasn't engaged on two fronts?

Also, what actions did Luke prevent Palpatine from taking that would have prevented the Rebellion's victory?

[Anderson]

What would have happened in WWII if Germany wasn't engaged on two fronts?

Also, what actions did Luke prevent Palpatine from taking that would have prevented the Rebellion's victory?

He emotionally manipulated Palpatine's bottom bitch into throwing his ass down a reactor shaft.

[BMichaelKrol]

He emotionally manipulated Palpatine's bottom bitch into throwing his ass down a reactor shaft.

And if he hadn't, Lando would still have blown up the Death Star killing them both.