New movies undeserving of their own thread - KILLED BY RYAN REYNOLDS

[Martin]

I don't have a problem with Twilight and I find people who go out of their way to bash it to be "fucking retarded fanboy dipshits," to be politically correct.

Steph Meyer seems like a perfectly nice woman and the kind of snide remarks coming outta other authors like Stephen King reek of 100% Grade-A jealousy. What, because her being a gazillionaire is fucking suddenly stopping your world or something, King? Go fuck yourself and "retire" again...then write shitty movie-reviews for Entertainment Weekly. Seriously if she wasn't Mormon, we wouldn't hear shit from anyone and this "Bella is a terrible role model for girls" bullshit. IT'S ABOUT GODDAMN VAMPIRES AND WEREWOLVES. Where does any of these characters being "role models" come into equation? Not to mention, isn't her fucking character like 17-18 years old? You know many kids that age who weren't total self-obsessed asses? I love Superman and Indiana Jones but you don't see me personally aspiring to be like them BECAUSE THEY'RE FUCKING MAKE BELIEVE!

Let those fangirls have their fun and go back to playing with your Transformers action figures is how I see it.

That said...the werewolf falling in love with a baby? Yeah, there's no way to spin that. That is fucked. up.

You completely fail to mention that the novels are, according to Meyer herself, propaganda for abstinence, and are pro-life in every way. Worst, they are terribly written. And like Billy said, they are terribly offensive to women with a brain. Fuck, I read the 1st one to understand the hype. It's shit. SHIT.

So no, the backlash is well deserved if anything.

[B_Metal]

You completely fail to mention that the novels are, according to Meyer herself, propaganda for abstinence, and are pro-life in every way. Worst, they are terribly written. And like Billy said, they are terribly offensive to women with a brain. Fuck, I read the 1st one to understand the hype. It's shit. SHIT.

So no, the backlash is well deserved if anything.

Add on top of all of that the saturation of ads for the first movie? FUUUUUUUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck I got tired of that Team bullshit sooooo fast.

[FilmNerdJamie]

You completely fail to mention that the novels are, according to Meyer herself, propaganda for abstinence, and are pro-life in every way. Worst, they are terribly written. And like Billy said, they are terribly offensive to women with a brain. Fuck, I read the 1st one to understand the hype. It's shit. SHIT.

So no, the backlash is well deserved if anything.

So it's terrible for the writer to put their own personal ideology into their work?! Holy fuck! That's never, ever, ever happened before! In the history of all fucking art.

[B_Metal]

I think it's more so that it's thinly veiled and not even remotely well written but to each their own.

[Lisa]

I've admitted here before that I've read the books and seen the movies (always while waiting for them to come out on DVD - always!), and for whatever weird reason, I keep coming back. I find her writing clunky, I find the acting in movies horrible, I find both the books and the movies to be offensive to women for the reasons that Billy and Martin both pointed out, and as someone who's favorite vampire tale is "Salem's Lot", I find the "Twilight" saga to be weak and flaccid as a vampire story. Why I keep coming back to read them and see them, I don't know, I really truly don't. I don't enjoy them, but I always check out the next chapter of what's going on.

There was a fairly good article - in either Salon or NPR, I forget which - which pointed out how "Breaking Dawn" sends a particularly dangerous message to young girls. In the book, when Edward and Bella finally do the horizontal mambo on their honeymoon, Edward and his super-duper vampire strength pretty much beat Bella to a pulp during sex. She wakes up in the morning covered in bruises that are the shape of her new husband's hands - great message for all the 14 year olds who eat this shit up with a spoon, eh? Ohhhh, it's okay, mind you! He loves her! It's just that he's a super strong vampire and she's a human! He doesn't mean to hurt her, so it's perfectly okay that she comes back for more, a second time around, before any of the bruises even fade. (Please, PLEASE, tell me that you guys got that that was heavy sarcasm!)

And yeah, I get the pro-life message loud and clear from her - the baby is basically killing Bella from the inside, but Bella briefly sees her wonderful Edward and his wonderful father as monsters when they tell her they have to abort it before it kills her. Only when they agree to let her keep it does she trust them. Yeah, it's pretty out there.

Oh, and it's not just a werewolf falling in love with a baby, mind you. It's a werewolf falling in love with a half-vampire, half-human baby. So... there's that.

EDIT: It was NPR - http://www.npr.org/2011/11/17/142248...onsense-ensues. The point I really strongly agreed with was this one:

But when a saga popular with pre-adolescent girls peaks romantically on a night that leaves the heroine to wake up covered with bruises in the shape of her husband's hands — and when that heroine then spends the morning explaining to her husband that she's incredibly happy even though he injured her, and that it's not his fault because she understands he couldn't help it in light of the depth of his passion — that's profoundly irresponsible.

[IggytheBorg]

I think it's more so that it's thinly veiled and not even remotely well written but to each their own.

I admit I am limited in my "Twilight" experience; haven't read any of the books, and only saw the 1st movie. It was more romance than horror movie, and I didn't like it for that reason. So I don't have any insight into how the author's ideology may or may not pervade the story. But I am a big fan of C. S. Lewis' work, and if there's ever been a heavier handed use of ideology I haven't seen it. In fact, I avoided reading any of his books until about 5 years ago (or thereabouts) for just that reason. But they are so well written & entertaining that I greatly enjoyed them, Christian symbology aside. My pint, and I think B_Metal is on the same page here, is that if the "Twilight" books are as badly written as the movie leads me to believe they are, they deserve scorn for that reason. I don't particularly have a problem w/ authors injecting ideology into their works. One can choose to overlook what one finds odious (as I choose to overlook the racism sometimes apparent in HPL's & Robert E. Howard's works) if the enjoyment of the work for its own sake is there; or decline to read that author's work altogether if it isn't.

[Lisa]

is that if the "Twilight" books are as badly written as the movie leads me to believe they are, they deserve scorn for that reason.

They are.

[Martin]

So it's terrible for the writer to put their own personal ideology into their work?! Holy fuck! That's never, ever, ever happened before! In the history of all fucking art.

See below.

I've admitted here before that I've read the books and seen the movies (always while waiting for them to come out on DVD - always!), and for whatever weird reason, I keep coming back. I find her writing clunky, I find the acting in movies horrible, I find both the books and the movies to be offensive to women for the reasons that Billy and Martin both pointed out, and as someone who's favorite vampire tale is "Salem's Lot", I find the "Twilight" saga to be weak and flaccid as a vampire story. Why I keep coming back to read them and see them, I don't know, I really truly don't. I don't enjoy them, but I always check out the next chapter of what's going on.

There was a fairly good article - in either Salon or NPR, I forget which - which pointed out how "Breaking Dawn" sends a particularly dangerous message to young girls. In the book, when Edward and Bella finally do the horizontal mambo on their honeymoon, Edward and his super-duper vampire strength pretty much beat Bella to a pulp during sex. She wakes up in the morning covered in bruises that are the shape of her new husband's hands - great message for all the 14 year olds who eat this shit up with a spoon, eh? Ohhhh, it's okay, mind you! He loves her! It's just that he's a super strong vampire and she's a human! He doesn't mean to hurt her, so it's perfectly okay that she comes back for more, a second time around, before any of the bruises even fade. (Please, PLEASE, tell me that you guys got that that was heavy sarcasm!)

And yeah, I get the pro-life message loud and clear from her - the baby is basically killing Bella from the inside, but Bella briefly sees her wonderful Edward and his wonderful father as monsters when they tell her they have to abort it before it kills her. Only when they agree to let her keep it does she trust them. Yeah, it's pretty out there.

Oh, and it's not just a werewolf falling in love with a baby, mind you. It's a werewolf falling in love with a half-vampire, half-human baby. So... there's that.

EDIT: It was NPR - http://www.npr.org/2011/11/17/142248...onsense-ensues. The point I really strongly agreed with was this one:

See that Jamie? When that message, which is highly immoral and dangerous, is AIMED AT TEENS, who are easily influenced, then yes, it's despicable, and Meyer should be beaten to a pulp live on TV for our pleasure. Fuck that bitch.

[FilmNerdJamie]

When it's an ideology you disagree with it's immoral and dangerous and we should just "fuck that bitch?" Gotcha. Guess that means I just call up-their-own-ass dipshits like Sorkin dangerous then, eh? Of course not.

And once again, I'm really glad we're taking a story involving vampires and werewolves seriously and with a straight face how its influencing young girls... Because we all know about those string of stories across the US of young girls waiting till marriage till they fuck emo vampires and shit. Gotcha.

[B_Metal]

Just for the record, I have a problem with how shitty the writing/acting are in the respective mediums. And yeah, on top of that sending teenage girls the idea that it's cool to get roughed up because he loves you pretty much deserves a "fuck that bitch."

Glad we're on the same wavelength.

[Abraham Smashington]

Lesley thought it was ok. A tad laughable. Also, the books are terrible. The movies are laughable. But I watch Troma flicks so what the fuck can I say.

[Abraham Smashington]

Wait, is someone defending Twilight? Awesome. *grabs popcorn*

[Lisa]

And once again, I'm really glad we're taking a story involving vampires and werewolves seriously and with a straight face how its influencing young girls....

But Jamie, the point we're trying to make is - it doesn't matter that it's about vampires and werewolves. The point is - Meyers has found a niche that appeals to young girls. She's got them hooked. Now, what does she choose to do with that? How responsible does she choose to be with both what she writes and her audience? Regardless of whether it's a story about two humans, a vampire and a human, or the epic love story between a mailbox and a tree, the answer is - "not very responsible". Forget that the characters are make-believe. She's sending a loud, clear message to young girls that it's okay if the love of your life covers you with bruises - he loves you, and it just proves how crazy he is about you! It's also sending the message that bad people will want you to abort your baby, but everything will be fine and dandy once you decide to see that pregnancy through.

It also sends the message that as a girl, you don't have to do anything with your life but passively sit around and be loved and adored and protected by a boy. Don't make your own future happen. Don't look out for yourself and be independent. Let him handle it. And further, there's one little personality quirk of Bella's that really hints at this - Bella is very clumsy and very accident prone. So in the books, whenever she tries to do something independent or something on her own, she inevitably winds up bruising herself, spraining a wrist, breaking a bone, etc. But she's always safe with either Edward or Jacob. The message? "You'll just fuck yourself up if you try to be your own girl. Let the guy take care of you."

[Abraham Smashington]

And parents were worried about Harry Potter....

[Lisa]

And parents were worried about Harry Potter....

As a lapsed Catholic, you don't even want to know the conversation I had with a dear, dear Pentacostal friend of mine about that! Probably one of my favorite people in the world, but that chit-chat did leave me scratching my head.

EDIT: But you know, you bring up a good point. If you had a 14 year old daughter, who would you want her to idolize? Bella or Hermoine? Sure, Hermoine hangs out with Harry and Ron, but she's independent, smart, and capable enough to leave them in the dust. She's Harry's best friend, and she's in love with Ron, but they don't define her. Remember what Harry says to Ron in "Deathly Hallows" when there's the question of whether or not Hermoine should come with them: "Ron, we need her. We're dead if she doesn't come with us."